What Are the Obligatory Scenes for Genre Fiction?

I’ve been reading The Story Grid: What Good Editors Know by Shawn Coyne. It’s a meaty book on writing, from the point of view of an editor who has an eye for highly popular, commercially successful books.

His method is similar to Scott Bell’s Save the Cat outlining method, and since I’m a fan of that, I found this highly useful as well. My biggest takeaway is the concept that any given Genre has certain Obligatory Scenes along with its usual conventions.

For instance, he lists the Obligatory Scenes for a Mystery. My order is a little different than his, and I’ve added my own nicknames to the steps:

1. The Crime: A crime is committed—usually a murder.
2. The Crime as Trigger: The crime must occur reasonably early in the story.
3. The Criminal Mastermind: The criminal must be clever enough to have hidden his identity sufficiently that it’s not obvious from the start who committed the crime.
4. The Detective: The investigator must be clever enough to solve the crime. If he’s not a professional (cop, PI), he must have some special skill or knack that helps him uncover clues others miss.
5. Now It’s Personal: At some point, the investigation becomes personal for the investigator.
6. Clues & Red Herrings: The investigator finds clues, but some clues are red herrings.
7. J’accuse: The investigator uncovers/confronts/denounces the criminal.
8. Justice Theme: The ending results in justice, injustice, or ironic justice.

In a Medical Drama, like House, the Obligatory Scenes are exactly the same, but the “criminal” is a disease and the “detective” is the diagnostic doctor. The “suspects” are not being accused of a crime, but they are people who must be interrogated to find clues about the true identity of the mystery disease. As in any other mystery, many of the suspects lie to protect themselves for various reasons, leading to red herrings.

For Horror, he lists these Obligatory Scenes:

1. Fate Worse Than Death: Something more than life is at stake. A fate worse than death is possible, such as torture or damnation.
2. Monster: The villain is far more powerful than the hero, possibly even supernatural.
3. Speech in Praise of the Villain: Early one, someone describes how insurmountably powerful and/or awesomely evil the monster is.
4. Hero at the Mercy of the Villain: There’s a scene near the climax where the protagonist seems to be utterly powerless against the villain.
5. Double Ending: There is a false ending where the villain seems defeated, but isn’t, followed by the real defeat of the (real) villain.

Thrillers, he says, are a combination of both these kinds of Obligatory Scenes.

Those are the genres he’s most familiar with, so unfortunately, he doesn’t give his take on other genres more of interest to me, such as Romance, Fantasy, or Science Fiction. So I’ll try my own hand at it.

For Science Fiction/Fantasy we’d need:

1. We’re Not in Kansas Anymore: We must learn early on that this universe differs from ours because it has some magic/tech that our universe does not.
2. Rules of the Universe: We must have some insight into how the magic/tech works—not the mechanics of it, but the global rules, such as who can use it, what it allows, etc.
3. All Magic Has a Price: There must be limitations to the magic/tech, a cost to using it.
4. Magic Makes Trouble: The magic/tech must shape the character and/or society in a way that drives the plot. The magic/tech or the society it enables, creates the problem.
5. Magic Aides the Hero: The magic/tech must also be relevant to how the problem is solved. (Even if the solution involves destroying it, as in Forbidden Planet, or being destroyed by it, as in 1984.)

Hm. I’m not sure if those are really Obligatory Scenes, in the same way that “Hero At the Mercy of the Villain” is a scene. I think there’s a real danger in both fantasy and science fiction of making those “telling” rather than “showing” scenes. Hence, the dreaded infodump: a pitfall for any novel, but speculative fiction especially. It is better if each of the above Obligatory features of sff are crafted as scenes.

If many of the usual scenes one might expect are missing, it’s because we often conflate Fantasy (especially) with a Quest plot. A Quest plot or an Epic plot has its own Obligatory Scenes and conventions, such as the Search for the McGuffin or Acquiring the McGuffin, the Final Stand Against Evil, etc.

But not all Fantasy, and certainly not all Science Fiction, involves a Quest or need be Epic in scale. I do think all fantasy & sf, even odd forms such as Literary Fantasy/SF, need to have the five features I’ve listed.

I’ll give Romance a shot. I think it’s easier, ironically, because there are more strict requirements.

1. The Cute Meet: Meeting the each other is an unusual, even life-changing event, or occurs during some life-changing event. (If they knew each other long ago, this is replaced by an Unexpected Reunion. Sometimes, the Cute Meet is included too, as a prologue or a flashback.)
2. The External Problem: Something outside the heroine and hero keeps them apart.
3. The Internal Problem: Some internal wound keeps the heroine and hero apart.
4. The Draw: Despite the problems, something forces the heroine and hero to spend time together.
5. The First Kiss: The heroine and hero express their attraction for the first time.
6. The First Fight: The heroine and hero quarrel, but overcome their difficulty.
7. The Commitment: The heroine and hero admit to loving one another or in some way commit to one another.
8. The Betrayal: Despite their commitment, either the external force or internal force keeping the lover apart threatens to separate them forever. There seems to be no way to overcome this.
9. Love Conquers All: The heroine and hero overcome the betrayal, proving the strength of their commitment (even, in a tragedy like Romeo and Juliet, or a romance without a HEA like The Titanic or The Notebook) despite death). In other almost-romances, or romances involving very young teens, an ambiguous “happily ever after for now” is acceptable.
10. The Happily Ever After (HEA): In a true sits-on-the-romance-shelf genre Romance, as opposed to a strongly romantic story that might end tragically, the hero and heroine remain in love, remain together, and remain alive: they live happily ever after. Their HEA may be confirmed in an epilogue, or whenever the couple shows up in later books (about other couples) of the same series.

Just as Coyne says you can figure up the Obligatory Scenes for a Thriller by combining Mystery, Action, and Horror requirements, so you can figure out the Obligatory Scenes you’d need for a Paranormal Romance by combining the Fantasy and Romance requirements.

For instance, you still have a Cute Meet, but it should also let the reader know that magic exists in this world. (For instance, she finds a lamp and a sexy, overpowering Genie appears, offering to be service her every whim; or she is a werewolf hunter saved from a werewolf ambush by a mysterious hunk.) You will still need an External or an Internal problem, and it should be caused by magic. (For instance, the Genie despises her for enslaving him, but she has no way to free him from the spell; he doesn’t want to tell her that he’s a werewolf too.)

Knowing the Obligatory Scenes is not the same as having an outline for a novel. Not even close. These are simply the minimum requirements needed to center a novel within a certain genre.

 

Buy The Story Grid: What Good Editors Know by Shawn Coyne

Recommended for Writers: The Story Grid by Shawn Coyne

The classic book on outlining, originally written for screenplays, is Blake Snyder’s Save the Cat.

For some examples of how I use the Snyder outline, and other outlining methods I use, you can peek at some posts I did for NaNoWriMo:

How To Create A Three Act Beat Sheet

My Favorite Outlining Method

How To Make Your Own Sticky-Note Outlining Kit

So obviously, I like the Blake Snyder outline, and so do a lot of others. There are a lot of books that teach the basic principles of Outlining, but few that are substantial enough that they add anything new to what Snyder said first and better.

The Story Grid, however, is a full of gold. It takes the standard Outline and beefs it up for the Big Leagues. The key difference? The Story Grid attacks the specifics of Genres. Not all Genre story arcs are covered in depth, but enough to convey the idea that there is no one formula to fit all.

I’ll be discussing what I’ve learned from this book and how I apply it in my posts (later this month), “What are the Obligatory Scenes for Genre Fiction?” and “How to Use Reiteration in Romance.”

Buy The Story Grid: What Good Editors Know by Shawn Coyne

Tara Maya’s Book Review: The Fire Seer by Amy Raby

Caveat—Reader Beware!

My reviews are written from a writer’s perspective, with an eye to dissecting good novels to find out what makes them work. Although I try to avoid explicitly discussing book endings, I am not as careful about avoiding all spoilers as some reviewers. I find if I employ too much caution about giving away plot twists, I am not able to provide a concrete analysis of the book’s structure. And frankly, I hate vague reviews.

So… there may be spoilers. If that bothers you, read the book first. Then come back and read my analysis and let me know if you agree…or what I missed!

Title: The Fire Seer

Author: Amy Raby

Genre: Fantasy Romance

Read: First Time

Style: Third Person Past

Type: Kindle ebook

* * * * *

Overview:

The Fire Seer is structured by a murder mystery, which the heroine and hero must solve together, much to the heroine’s dismay, because they have a history—and it’s not a pretty one! Honestly, the hero had done something so unforgivable to the heroine when they were both younger, that I was really on the edge of my seat trying to figure out how Amy would redeem him and make me want the heroine to forgive him, never mind love him. But Amy pulled it off.

Plot Summary:

Taya lives in a society where anyone with magic must belong to a monopolistic organization. The alternative is to drink a potion that eliminates one’s magic. Those who use magic without permission are called “jackals” and treated as criminals. Taya is on her first assignment after graduating her training, and her job is to investigate a murder and hunt down the jackal responsible.

Unfortunately, Mandir, the man assigned to protect and aid her in her mission was the same boy who tormented her in school—and even tried to kill her. Though he should have been executed or at least deprived of his magic for attempted murder, because Mandir is a prince, he was assigned only a year penance.

As Taya and Mandir work together to find the murderer, they discover that situation is rather more complex that it first appeared. Taya comes to question everything she’s been taught to believe, about her organization, her mission and her partner.

Characters:

TAYA (Heroine): Most magic-users in their society are from the upper two castes, but Taya is from the lowly farmer’s caste. That made her feel self-conscious from the start… and being teased throughout her school years by popular Prince Mandir didn’t help her make friends or fit in. Her background has made her all the more determined to loyal and skilled, however. This makes it all the more difficult for her when she starts to question some aspects of her training and beliefs.

MANDIR (Hero): Mandir’s father might have been royalty, but he was also a malicious, manipulative bastard who taught his son only cruelty. Mandir has struggled to become a better person, but it’s taken harsh experience to change him. How can Mandir convince Taya that he’s not the same boorish boy who hurt her? How can he expect her to trust him? And yet, Mandir’s job is to protect her, whether she wants to believe it or not, and the danger to her is real.

Setting/Worldbuilding:

I loved the culture based loosely on the ancient and mysterious Indian archeological find in Harrapa, because I am a total archeology geek. There’s a caste system and an interesting theology of Three Goddesses, which ties into the rules of magic as well as the themes of the book. The setting is well-developed and unique, not at all cookie-cutter, making it an excellent fantasy. However, the setting never overtakes the focus on the relationship between the characters.

Complexity/Series Arc:

The novel juggles the requirements of three genres: Fantasy, Mystery, and Romance. The elements of each are handled with finesse, in perfect proportion. The plot flows well, with no slow spots, and nothing hard to follow. There are enough suspects to give the mystery heft, but the mystery, like the setting, does not steal the focus from the changing relationship between the heroine and hero. There are 43 chapters, most with just one scene; 16 of 43 chapters have more than one scene, for a total of 62 scenes. Only one chapter, close to the midpoint, has 5 scenes. The Actual Midpoint = Scene 31, Chapter 24; the Story Midpoint = Scene 38, Chapter 26. This is the point when Taya’s tentatively growing trust in Mandir is shattered by a seeming betrayal.

As in a Romance novel, there are two PoV characters, Taya and Mandir. Taya’s PoV predominates, while 11 of 62 scenes from Mandir’s PoV. Nonetheless, the scenes from the hero’s PoV are critical, since they demonstrate his desire to be a better man is sincere, and brings the reader over to his side before Taya herself starts to trust him.

In addition, there are also 8 flashback scenes, covering three years (between nine and six years before the story), all brief and from Taya’s point of view. The flashback scenes are all well chosen and well positioned to caste light on the current events. They work well to add depth to the story.

62 scenes

Actual Midpoint = Scene 31, Chapter 24; Story Midpoint = Scene 38, Chapter 26

16 of 43 chapters have more than one scene

1 chapter has 5 scenes

11 of 62 scenes from Hero PoV

8 flashback scenes, covering three years (between nine and six years before the story)

Code: Pink = Heroine; Green = Hero; Aqua = Heroine’s Flashback

Although apparently the first book in a series, The Fire Seer stands alone. The mystery and the romance plots both come to a satisfying conclusion.

Personal Remarks:

I have enjoyed the other Fantasy Romance series by Amy Raby, and I wasn’t disappointed by this one set in a new fantasy world. It was just what I was in the mood for. This is the first book in a new series. As of writing this review, I haven’t read the second book, The Fire Seer and Her Quradum by Amy Raby.

My reading time: 6 hrs.

Buy The Fire Seer by Amy Raby.

Buy The Fire Seer and Her Quradum by Amy Raby.

Read this month’s other Book Reviews:

Tara Maya’s Book Review: Enchantment by Orson Scott Card

Novel Excerpt: The Fire Seer by Amy Raby

About The Fire Seer:

PAIRED WITH HER WORST ENEMY…

Taya has risen from humble roots to become a fire seer in the Coalition of Mages. Eager to prove herself, she arrives in the town of Hrappa to locate a “jackal”—a mage operating outside the Coalition’s authority—who has murdered three people.

But in Hrappa, she discovers that the man assigned to be her bodyguard is Mandir, her nemesis from years ago. When she and Mandir were students, he bullied her so severely he was sentenced to a year of penance and moved to another temple.

When Mandir sees that he’s been partnered with Taya, all his old torment comes rushing back. He’s had a crush on Taya since the day they began their training, but he pushed her away, ashamed of his attraction to someone so far beneath his social class. He regrets that now and intends to make an honest attempt to win her heart—if she can forgive him for his past sins.

But first they must find the murderous jackal, before the jackal finds them.

WINNER OF THE DAPHNE DU MAURIER AWARD

Excerpt:

Chapter 1: Hrappa

Taya trotted her black mare past the flat, unwelcoming stares of the Hrappan townsfolk. She faced forward, reminding herself not to take it personally. It wasn’t who she was that bothered them. It was what she represented.

The sunlight was fading as she rode up to the Hall of Judgment. A haughty-looking servant in belted indigo awaited her on the steps. Taya dropped lightly from the mare’s back and brushed the travel dust from her clothes. She’d come in Coalition regalia, as per instructions. Over her short riding pants, she wore a green robe of soft cotton. A belt of worked silver with a fire agate mounted on the buckle encircled her waist. Her hair was pulled up into a fan-shaped headdress, and her arms jangled with bracelets—silver, since her people did not wear gold.

The servant’s gaze raked her. “You must be the drain-cleaner we sent for.”

Taya blinked in surprise. “No, I’m Coalition.”

“Ah,” said the servant, taking the mare’s reins. “I never would have guessed.”

Taya’s cheeks warmed. Sometimes she didn’t notice right away when a person was being insincere.

The servant straightened. “What am I supposed to do with that?”

Lumbering up the stairs was Piru, her pack elephant. He was a dwarf variety, no larger than her mare, but tame and loyal and incredibly strong. “Put him in a stall next to the mare. Has my partner arrived?”

“He arrived yesterday.”

He. So her partner was a man. Taya didn’t care one way or another, so long as he was competent, but she’d been curious.

The servant circled the elephant dubiously. “Where’s the lead rope?”

“You don’t need one. Just take the mare and he’ll follow her. His name is Piru. Give him a good feed of hay and scratch him behind the ears.”

The servant gave her a look that said, I’d sooner rub a sand viper’s belly.

Poor Piru. Maybe Taya would be able to visit him in the stable herself. “Is my partner available for me to confer with before I see the magistrate?”

“The magistrate wants to see you immediately. Your partner is with him.” The servant pointed. “Straight inside, first hallway on the right, second door on the left.” He whistled, and a boy padded up the steps. The two of them spoke briefly, and the boy took the mare’s reins and led her away. Piru started to follow but hesitated, turning his gray head to Taya in confusion.

“Go on,” she urged, and Piru trotted off, ears flapping. Taya smiled.

She straightened her headdress, noting with exasperation that several locks of her hair had come loose. She tried shoving them back in, but other pieces fell out, and she decided just to leave it be. She wouldn’t make a perfect impression, but how could she be expected to after traveling all day?

Aside from its huge size and arched entryway, the Hall of Judgment was like most Hrappan buildings, a flat rectangle of baked brick. The building was stuffy inside, but now that the sun had dropped below the horizon, it would cool off. Taya turned into the first hallway on the right and looked for the second door on the left. It was guarded by a lightly armored man with a bronze mace at his belt. She caught the guard’s eye and he nodded, granting her permission to enter.

The room was unexpectedly large. A gentle breeze threaded through two windows overlooking a leafy courtyard. A high seat rested upon a raised dais, undoubtedly the chair from which the magistrate handed down his decisions, but it was empty. Three men sat around a table in the center of the room.

One of the men was old and sick—disturbingly so. His stomach was bloated and misshapen, his hair lank, and his face sweaty, as if sitting in a chair was a great effort for him. Taya suspected he was near death.

The man sitting next to him was young and healthy. Both bore the facial tattoos of the ruling caste and were well dressed. The third man, who had his back to her, wore Coalition green and silver and was obviously her partner. Seeing him, her anxiety about the mission eased a little. He looked like the sort of man one could depend on—tall and strong, with a confident manner. He was a quradum, one of the Coalition’s magic-using warriors, and his role was to protect and advise her. Given the hostility of the townsfolk here, she might need protection. As for advice, she welcomed any guidance on her inaugural mission. She hoped her partner was as seasoned as he looked.

The younger man stood to welcome her but the sick man only gave her an apologetic look. Taya gathered he was not capable of standing. Her partner rose, too, with leonine grace. As he turned, she moved toward him eagerly and froze in shock.

She knew that face.

Even if she had been uncertain in her recollection, the facial tattoos were unmistakable. The sunburst on his forehead and the lines just beneath his eyelids, all in dark red, marked him as a member of the royal house. She was looking at Mandir isu Sarrum. Taya felt sick.

Recognition dawned in Mandir’s eyes as well, and he went as still as an onager jack who catches the scent of a lion in the grass.

Buy The Fire Seer by Amy Raby.

Differences Between Genre Fiction Before and After the Millennium (Guest Post by Jack P.)

By and large, 90s was about wondrous adventures and hilarious hijinks along the way. Since the early 00s, it took a turn toward the night along with society at large. Here are some of the main differences that happened beyond the Post-Millennial Shift, due in no small part to the events of 9/11/01. Which is better? That’s for the ages to decide.

5) Light vs Dark

The 90s gave us Discworld, Jumanji, and Early Harry Potter. These were light stories, about character facing troubles, and dealing with issues, but of a relatively narrow scope and tied to their lives almost personally, allowing them to learn and grow

After 2000, we got the Da Vinci Code, the Kite Runner, and Later HP, where we learned our faith may be misplaced, the horrors humans are capable of, and the need to save the world from evil.

4) Fantastic Escapism vs Gritty Realism

Instead of the journey and adventures of Hercules, 3 Star Treks, and the 5th Element, we have the harsh tones, bleak outlooks, and moral ambiguity of The Dark Knight, Watchmen, and zombie-everything.

 

3) Sense of Wonder vs Sense of Woe

We once had a sense of wonder and comedy in Jurassic Park, Gattaca, and Men in Black. Now we have the tragedy and tumult of Twilight, Hunger Games, and Game of Thrones.

 

2) The Televolution of TV

 Television has experienced an evolution since 2000. Instead of formulaic shows with a weekly story, the advent of DVDs, time shifting, and now streaming has led to television delving deeper into itself, with richer characters, season-long or even series-long plots with more layers than a Kardashian wedding cake, and some of the best writing and acting talent migrating to TV away from movies.

1) more More MORE

With the internet, we have more of everything. Webisodes, eBooks, Webcomics, YouTube clips, hash tags, community tags, reality TV, refined reality TV, and the constant need for content from 500 channels of cable and 20+ screen theaters. Think about that – in less than 100 years, we’ve gone from 1 movie every month or so, to over 200 movies produced every year. I don’t know about you, but I can’t keep up, and neither can anyone!

Tara Maya’s Quickie Check In

This week I’ve been working on Mirror, Book 8 in The Unfinished Song, and also on a section of Sworn, Book 10. (There’s a reason; technically the events of the storyline from Sworn antedate the events in Mirror. That’s one of the odd things that happens when the Story Order of events differs from the Chronological Order of events.)

Meanwhile, relevant to this month’s theme about Fantasy Romance, check out this fun interview on fantasy in romance, romance in fantasy, blending genres, Beta heroes, pricing of ebooks and much more!

Here’s a snippet where Rachel discusses her appearance on a panel at the Romantic Times convention:

Rachel:  Exactly, and, and it’s so funny, ‘cause, like, I was sitting, I’d be sitting on a panel, and it’d be, like, you know, really badass-looking chick in tight leather and, like, a dude with abs, and, like, a clinch cover, and then there’s me with powered armor.  You know, I, I was, it was very kind of a strange situation, but I really, really loved it, because romance readers are, are some of my favorite readers, because the romance community is so welcoming of other genres, and, like, ‘cause I, when I put kissing in my military sci-fi, I got a lot of are you sure you want to do this?

Sarah:  Oh, no, kissing cooties, man!

Rachel:  ‘Cause there’s going to be cooties in your powered armor.

Sarah:  You cannot have kissing cooties.

Rachel:  And, and, but you know what, ‘cause my readership is about 50/50 male/female, and I had very few complaints about the actual romance.  I had a couple of complaints from people who either didn’t think it went far enough or thought there was too much, so it was like the amount of romance was in question, but the fact that there was a legitimate romance was just kind of accepted.  Like, I didn’t, I didn’t get nearly – ‘cause I was, I was girding my loins for, like, the true science fiction author brigade, but no, everyone, everyone was real happy with it.

Sarah:  No, it’s, it’s a total, it’s a tonal difference, I think, between science fiction and fantasy communities –

Rachel:  Mm-hmm.

Sarah:  – and the romance community, especially at RT.  I remember when John Scalzi was a guest because he was receiving an award, he came to RT – I want to say it was Kansas City, two years ago – and wrote a post on his blog about how he realized at some strange moment that he was the only dude in, like, a room of several thousand women.  No one asked him for his credentials, no one wanted to quiz him on how much he knew about something.  It was like, you’re here, there’s a bar, let’s hang.  It’s a completely different kind of interaction from what I know of the two different communities.

Rachel:  That, that is absolutely true, and, like, ‘cause I’ve done a lot of sci-fi and fantasy cons, and they are lovely, don’t get me wrong.  They’re really fun, they’re really nerdy, and it’s very exciting, ‘cause I’m also a big sci-fi/fantasy fan and reader so, again, as a fan, it was very exciting, but there is definitely sort of a geekier-than-thou thing going on, where you’ve got to constantly kind of one-up your geek cred –

Sarah:  Yep.

Rachel:  – whereas at RT it was like, oh, my God, you’re a writer?  I’m a writer!  What do you write?  That’s amazing!  Oh, you read romance?  I love Regencies!  Let’s talk about our favorite Regencies!  It was just this really, really warm, welcoming atmosphere, and every, and every interaction I’ve had with the romance community has been like that.

Sarah:  Yep.

Rachel:  It’s, it’s just been fantastic, and I, I hang out on romance blogs just ‘cause they’re freaking fun places to be.  I, that’s how I found you!  I was a giant reader of Smart Bitches.  Back when I had my day job, y’all were, like, my favorite thing to read at work –

Sarah:  [Laughs]

Rachel:  – and, and I got a bunch of book recommendations from you when I was first getting into romance, ‘cause I didn’t even read romance until I was out of college.  I’d never even –

Sarah:  Oh, no kidding!

Rachel:  Yeah, well, I’d never, I’d – my parents were big sci-fi/fantasy nerds, and they didn’t read a lot of romance, and I’d read, like, some Anne McCaffrey, which kind of blurs the line, ‘cause she’s got a lot of romance in her sci-fi, but I’d never read, like, a Regency, and then one day, I’m like, that sounds really cool, and I picked up, I can’t even remember what the first one was now, but it was, like, a free book, and I just kind of picked it up, and oh, that was the rabbit hole –

Sarah:  Yep.

Rachel:  – let me tell you.  Like, couple hundred books later, and, and I love it.  I do.

And don’t forget to check out Rachel Aaron’s latest books, Nice Dragons Finish Last and One Good Dragon Deserves Another, which are Urban Fantasy:

Sarah:  Cool!  So you mentioned earlier that you were working on dragons –

Rachel:  Mm-hmm.

Sarah:  – which of course is the thing that I like most.

Rachel:  Yay!

Sarah:  What are, what are you working on, book two?

Rachel:  I’m working on, I just, I finished the, the second book about a month ago, which is called One Good Dragon Deserves Another, and – ‘cause we got a theme here –

Sarah:  Mm-hmm.

Rachel:  Nice Dragons Finish Last, One Good Dragon Deserves Another –

Sarah:  Of course.

Rachel:  Dragon theme, and this book is really fun.  It was kind of a bear for me to write because I, I would just, I just had a, I just had a wrong-headed idea about the series and I kept trying to make it work, and it didn’t work, and I can be very stubborn.  I kept trying to make it work, and eventually I just had to say, okay, this plot is clearly not working.  Let’s back it up and try something totally different –

Sarah:  Mm-hmm.

Rachel:   – and that’s when I fixed it, but it took me a lot longer than it should have because of that.  But we’re on, we’re on track now, and I’m very excited about the book.  It’s all about sort of – you know, in the first book, it was all about Julius gets kicked out – Julius is my nice dragon – gets kicked out in the middle of Detroit, in the DFZ, which is the Detroit Free Zone, which is ruled by a, by a spirit who has ordered all dragons kill on sight, and his dragon form has been sealed, so he’s stuck as a human without all his powers, and he’s really just –he spends the whole book just desperately trying to survive and keep his head above water –

Sarah:  Right.

Rachel:  – and in the second book, he’s really got his feet under him more, and you really start seeing him kind of come into his own, and it’s, the books are, you know, Julius is twenty-four, so he’s, he’s definitely an adult in these books, but they’re really almost a coming-of-age story, ‘cause Julius was this big slacker.  He was, you know, he lived in his, he lived in his mom’s basement of her mountain, basically, and hiding from all of his more powerful siblings, and it’s the story of how this dragon whose motto used to be keep your head down, don’t draw attention, shut up, and hope they go away, started, becomes, starts really coming into his own and standing up for what he believes in, and he is a very nice, nice dragon.  He’s a very good person in a world where niceness and goodness are seen as unforgivable weaknesses to be exploited, and so he has to kind of be almost, almost aggressively nice, if that makes sense, and I have a lot of fun with that, ‘cause I really love, I really love the idea of compassion as a, compassion as a strength, because it gets shown as a weakness so much.

Sarah:  Yep.

Rachel:  And so I loved, I love working with that.  And also in this book, the secondary character, Marci, who’s the love interest, ‘cause there’s a little romance between Julius and Marci, and she’s a mage, she really comes into her own in this book.  Marci is just amazing, and she is so too short for this ride, but makes it work.  Oh, it was so fun.  Her stuff is so fun to write, but this, I mean, it just goes crazy, and, yeah.  I don’t believe in, like, small stories.  All my stories always get enormous, and, like, not in terms of word count, but in, just in terms of the scale and the scope.  I like to go big or go home, and that definitely happened in this novel, Sarah.  It’s going to be really fun.

You can listen to the podcast or read the transcript.

Buy Nice Dragons Finish Last and One Good Dragon Deserves Another by Rachel Aaron.